I can't argue with a request to simplify the Sametime Gateway installation. I have one client who has been trying off and on for 18 months to get it working!

Difficult for a small business that just committed to going with Lotus Notes to then tell them that if they want to have IM with their employees and home access, they need a separate server for that -- which implies: new server OS license, new iron, additional backup license, possibly a new Domino license, more backup tapes, more monitoring, more maintenance.

Hard to swallow that for just IM. Keep the basic components simple and you'll increase distribution.

@2 - You won't need any additional Domino licenses. In a nutshell, Domino includes Sametime Entry entitlement and if you choose to use the included Sametime entitlement, IBM will give you a Domino license to run it on. You will need separate hardware and a server OS license, or you can virtualize and run Sametime Entry on CentOS.

@3 - There has been much discussion on this topic.

Here's the answer I saw in 10/2009, from a reputable IBM'er:

" the provision for installing Domino to run Sametime is only for those customers who are not otherwise Domino customers."

More fully:

A server is a server is a server. The Sametime situation has changed over the years as well -- the provision for installing Domino to run Sametime is only for those customers who are not otherwise Domino customers.

"If You do not yet have IBM Lotus Domino installed in Your enterprise pursuant to separate licenses with IBM, You may install on the same machine copies of IBM Lotus Domino equal to the number of copies of Program servers installed."

{ Link }

@3 Was thinking of a case where one has clustering and needs a Domino Enterprise license for their firm...then they would need the extra server license, as I recall. If they say, are using Domino Express licensing, then no additional Domino purchased license is required.

I agree with the Sametime Entry servers being free. I prefer Linux myself, but not all of my clients will allow an officially unsupported OS despite CentOS being a quality product -- would want RHEL or SLES on their servers, and introduces a fee, but a fee that is significantly less than a Windows server license plus the extra CALs.

Thanks @4 @5 for the lucidity.

@Peter- have them give me a ring, the gateway is not hard to do. I did the Lotusphere hands-on 2 years ago for the gateway and everyone had a live server running in two hours.

I am giving the session again this year on the Sametime Gateway, so have them drop by! The install book is also being updated for 8.5

I can't see it ever being on Domino due to the calls it makes. Sametime itself hardly uses Domino, it is just a layer that stores some config data in Domino, but all the services are independent.

One other item, in Sametime 8.5 chat/IM is still on Domino. Only the meeting services moved to Websphere. So no change for those only needing to chat

@7
I guess I didn't make my point clear (sorry!) - because of what the gateway does, it will always be WAS-based.
My point was to change the backend datastore and http stack to use domino for http and NSF.

So you end up with:
+ Samtime chat using Java and domino http (and NSFs to store some config -and chat logs?-)
+ Gateway using WAS with Domino HTTP and NSF for datastorage.


These functions are not related to meetings, and that's where the huge resource increases in 8.5 come from.

There even appear to be folks within IBM who think NSF is at least an adequate datastore:
{ Link }

@4/5 - What I relayed is what I was told by Adam Gartenberg when he was the Sametime product manager. I read the license agreement you linked and it appears they changed the terms. Now they give you the crippled Sametime server for "free" then make you pay for the server license it runs on. That's totally asinine and devalues the offering.

@6 - The only Domino Express license that allows clustering is the Utility server. You can layer licenses, though, so you could purchase both a Collaboration or Messaging Express license and a Utility Server Express license for the same machine and use clustering. At that point it may be more cost effective to use a Domino Enterprise license, depending on your user count.